Legislature(1999 - 2000)

05/16/1999 02:07 PM Senate FIN

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
MINUTES                                                                                                                         
SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE                                                                                                        
May 16, 1999                                                                                                                    
2:07 PM                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
TAPES                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SFC-99 # 142, Side A and Side B                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CALL TO ORDER                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Torgerson convened the meeting at approximately                                                                        
2:05 PM.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
PRESENT Senator Sean Parnell, Senator John Torgerson,                                                                           
Senator Randy Phillips, Senator Gary Wilken, Senator Lyda                                                                       
Green, Senator Al Adams were present when the meeting                                                                           
convened. Senator Loren Leman, Senator Pete Kelly and                                                                           
Senator Dave Donley arrived shortly thereafter.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Also Attending:                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Names of witnesses are listed in the minutes in the order                                                                       
they testified.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SUMMARY INFORMATION                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
HB 131-ANCHORAGE COASTAL WILDLIFE REFUGE                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
The committee heard public testimony and had questions for                                                                      
the Department of Transportation and Public Utilities and                                                                       
the sponsor.  The bill was reported out of committee.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 131                                                                                                              
"An Act relating to public rights-of-way and easements                                                                          
for surface transportation across the Anchorage                                                                                 
Coastal Wildlife Refuge."                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Public testimony was taken via teleconference from                                                                              
Anchorage and in-person from Juneau.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
The following witnesses testified via teleconference from                                                                       
Anchorage:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SANDRA JONES believed the public process of any changes to                                                                      
the refuge was important. She supported the legislation                                                                         
before the committee.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
WAYNE PICHON, 25-year Anchorage resident living along the                                                                       
refuge and former Alaska Coastal Zone Management                                                                                
Coordinator for the federal government in Alaska. He                                                                            
detailed his experience in wetlands management and related                                                                      
publications he authored. As a wetland scientist, he felt                                                                       
that a surface transportation right-of-way would harm the                                                                       
refuge.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
DEANNA ESSERT represented the 25,000 residents who lived                                                                        
along the refuge as the designated spokesperson.  She felt                                                                      
the Executive Branch had overextended its powers and they                                                                       
were looking toward the Legislature for assistance.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams wanted to know when the public hearings                                                                        
were held, what plan was before them for consideration.                                                                         
Was it just the bicycle path? Deanna Essert said they were                                                                      
looking at the coastal trail plan.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
DOUG PERKINS, Bayshore/Klat Community Council, testified in                                                                     
support of the bill with out any amendments. He had                                                                             
complaints about the Department of Fish and Game not                                                                            
issuing permits for the right-of-way. He told the committee                                                                     
they would hear that the issue was a local matter and the                                                                       
Legislature should not interfere. He believed that was not                                                                      
true because of the involvement with the Department of Fish                                                                     
and Game.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Senator Dave Donley spoke about the speed limit along                                                                           
Minnesota Ave. and the desire of the community council to                                                                       
keep it below 65 mph. He asked the witness to comment.                                                                          
Doug Perkins responded that he was not prepared to discuss                                                                      
that matter and continued commenting on the coastal trail.                                                                      
The council supported the construction of the trail.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MARY WHITMORE testified in support of the bill. She felt                                                                        
the current process was flawed and the Legislature should                                                                       
step in and help. She said the municipality was biased                                                                          
against the project. She wanted the Department of Fish and                                                                      
Game information and expertise to not be disregarded                                                                            
because of high-powered political desires to extend the                                                                         
trail.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
JANELLE FEIERABEND read testimony from another in support                                                                       
of the bill. She spoke of the importance of the refuge. Any                                                                     
attempts to build a trail would disrupt the water drainage.                                                                     
Also the presence of dogs in the area would be harmful to                                                                       
the birds that migrated and nested in the refuge.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
ED DOKOOZIAN was in favor of trails and also in favor of HB
131. The reasons to not put the bike trail through the                                                                          
coastal refuge had been well stated by witnesses before                                                                         
him. He added that there would be a risk of burglary to                                                                         
those homes along the trail. He spoke of the change in                                                                          
attitudes from the previously friendly community of                                                                             
Anchorage.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
JIM DOKOOZIAN registered civil engineer and marathon racer                                                                      
testified. He said there were practical areas to build                                                                          
trails and impractical areas to build trails.  He felt the                                                                      
state refuge was an impractical area.  The ground was                                                                           
unstable. He recommended finishing the network of inland                                                                        
trails instead.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SANDY SIMPSON wanted to see the coastal trail extended but                                                                      
was opposed to the use of the refuse for this purpose.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
PATRICIA GARRITY spoke of the wealthy homeowners who lived                                                                      
along the bluff and were opposed to the trail as it might                                                                       
spoil their view.  She was not one of them, but opposed the                                                                     
trail because of the harm it would cause to the refuge.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MIKE SZYMANSKI detailed his involvement in the issue                                                                            
listing his substantial credentials. He supported a                                                                             
comprehensive plan. He didn't see a problem with the                                                                            
current system and urged the Legislature not to get                                                                             
involved.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
ROBERT LAULE supported building additional trails in the                                                                        
southern portion of Anchorage.  He wanted to have the most                                                                      
miles per dollar realized from trail construction and                                                                           
didn't think this was one. Because of the remoteness of the                                                                     
trail, it could only be accessible to the most hardy of                                                                         
cyclists.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
BOB BROCK was in favor of recreation in the marsh in the                                                                        
refuge.  However, he felt that should be limited to the                                                                         
winter. After the snow melted, birds needed the area to be                                                                      
left pristine.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
JIM ARNESEN, President, Skyway Park Homeowners Association                                                                      
testified to the fragility of the refuge. He did not see                                                                        
how it was possible to build a trail and do it right.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
PATRICK WRIGHT, Chair, Anchorage Fish and Game Advisory                                                                         
Committee told of the meetings their group held on the                                                                          
matter. Biologists and engineers testified at the meetings.                                                                     
They favored extension of the trails, but only above the                                                                        
bluff.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
DAVID CARTER believed there was a lot of emotion and false                                                                      
information about this bill. He supported it. The bill                                                                          
would not affect the trail project that was going on                                                                            
currently. He said that the Department of Fish and Game had                                                                     
opposed construction of the trail in certain areas of the                                                                       
refuge and their advice had been ignored. He noted that the                                                                     
handicapped community was not represented on the planning                                                                       
committee.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
TERRY BURRELL, victim of post-polio syndrome, had concerns                                                                      
about the refuge. She complained about the planning                                                                             
committee process and the lack of representation by the                                                                         
handicapped population.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Tape: SFC - 99 #142, Side B    2:53PM                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Terry Burrell continued by saying that the trails would be                                                                      
unusable for many disabled recreationalists.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VINCE WETHINGTON had a bike trail running through his front                                                                     
yard. He was amazed by the attention this bill was getting.                                                                     
He read a letter from his eight-year old son who wanted the                                                                     
bill to be adopted.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
JEFF LOWENFELS pointed out that a portion of the proposed                                                                       
trail lay in an area that was under water.  Construction of                                                                     
a trail would be extremely expensive. He did not believe                                                                        
this was an all or nothing problem. He supported the bill,                                                                      
as it would give protection to a process that was not                                                                           
working. While many areas of the proposed trail would pose                                                                      
an engineering challenge, most areas would not. He spent                                                                        
much of his childhood playing in the refuge and thought                                                                         
there were many areas where trail construction would be                                                                         
feasible.  He noted another wetland estuary in San Diego he                                                                     
had visited.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
That concluded teleconference testimony.  The following                                                                         
witnesses testified in-person at Juneau:                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
DICK BISHOP, Vice-President, Alaska Outdoor Council,                                                                            
testified in opposition of the bill. It was a question of                                                                       
whether the Legislature had a role to play in the                                                                               
Legislative designated refuge.  The answer, in his opinion,                                                                     
was yes. He spoke of use for the rifle range and other                                                                          
recreation activities.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
ODEN BRUDIE, Juneau resident raised in Anchorage testified                                                                      
in opposition of the bill. He spoke about the continuity                                                                        
and safety of a connected trail in Anchorage available for                                                                      
year-round activities.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
DENNIS POSHARD, Legislative Liaison/Special Assistant,                                                                          
Office of the Commissioner, Department of Transportation                                                                        
and Public Facilities added to his testimony from the                                                                           
previous meeting.  He noted all the parties involved in the                                                                     
current process and other trails across the state. He felt                                                                      
this legislation was premature and the Legislature would                                                                        
always have the option of stopping trail development in                                                                         
areas it saw as inappropriate.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams was concerned with the portion of the bill                                                                     
dictating surface transportation.  He asked the witness if                                                                      
an amendment to change the designation to "Bicycle trail"                                                                       
would address the concerns.  Dennis Poshard said that would                                                                     
alleviate concerns of the Alaska Railroad.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Senator Randy Phillips wanted to know how much money had                                                                        
been spent on the project to date.  Dennis Poshard said it                                                                      
was in the planning stage. Approximately $400,000 had been                                                                      
spent with an appropriation of $1.2 million appropriated.                                                                       
That amount was intended for use in getting the project                                                                         
through the environmental phase. The design phase was                                                                           
anticipated to cost $1 million. Approximately $750,000 was                                                                      
budgeted for right-of-way acquisition. Finally, another $6                                                                      
million was estimated for construction.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Senator Randy Phillips clarified that the municipality had                                                                      
already spent approximately one-third of the $1.2 million                                                                       
appropriated.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Senator Randy Phillips wanted to know if that money for the                                                                     
design phase and the right-of-way phase had yet been                                                                            
appropriated.  Dennis Poshard answered that it had not as                                                                       
well as the remainder of the required funds, which had not                                                                      
been appropriated yet.  Senator Randy Phillips asked if                                                                         
that money had to be approved by the Legislature.  Dennis                                                                       
Poshard stated it was federal funds and it did require                                                                          
legislative approval.  It was determined that the only                                                                          
money currently available was for the planning process.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Senator Randy Phillips established that easements for the                                                                       
bike paths had not been granted and that alternate routes                                                                       
were proposed. He was trying to ascertain what the concerns                                                                     
were. He wondered if there was anyone "pulling strings."                                                                        
Dennis Poshard answered that he and Rob Bosworth of the                                                                         
Department of Fish and Game were unaware of any.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
JEFF LOGAN, staff to Representative Joe Green, came to the                                                                      
table to express the representative's gratitude.  He began                                                                      
speaking to an amendment that had been adopted by the                                                                           
Senate Transportation Committee.  After learning more about                                                                     
the issue, the members voted to remove the amendment.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Senator Randy Phillips asked this witness what was the                                                                          
commotion behind the legislation. Jeff Logan said there was                                                                     
the perception that the process was not being done above-                                                                       
board.  He referenced the Rabbit Creek Shooting Range.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams spoke to the aforementioned amendment,                                                                         
which he planned to offer. Senator Dave Donley requested                                                                        
the sponsor be heard on this matter.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Jeff Logan continued to address the concept of amending the                                                                     
bill to change the surface transportation designation to                                                                        
"bike path or trail." He detailed the relationship to the                                                                       
shooting range and any further expansion of the trail. He                                                                       
stressed that the shooting range was important to the                                                                           
community and if it were relocated that it be done so in                                                                        
the Anchorage area.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams asked if the shooting range had been                                                                           
placed in the capital budget. Co-Chair John Torgerson                                                                           
responded that funding for planning of the range was in the                                                                     
budget.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams noted that the transportation committee                                                                        
had adopted the amendment but then removed it.  He assumed                                                                      
the intelligence level of this committee was higher and                                                                         
that the change could be maintained.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Senator Sean Parnell wanted to know if the bill passed "as                                                                      
is", would expansion of the New Seward Highway be                                                                               
prohibited without prior Legislative approval other than                                                                        
the usual appropriation approval.  Jeff Logan answered that                                                                     
if the expansion required a surface transportation right-                                                                       
of-way or easement that would be correct.  Senator Sean                                                                         
Parnell wanted to know if the witness knew whether the                                                                          
easement would be required.  Jeff Logan had asked agency                                                                        
officials at the Department of Fish and Game and had not                                                                        
received a definitive answer. There was some thought that                                                                       
because it would be an inter-agency project, it might not                                                                       
be necessary. There was also some thought that because                                                                          
there was federal funding involved the federal government                                                                       
would require challenge-proof patient to use the land.                                                                          
Senator Sean Parnell found that hard to swallow.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams moved for adoption of Amendment #1.                                                                            
Senator Loren Leman objected.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Senator Dave Donley asked if the sponsor had considered any                                                                     
middle ground. Jeff Logan noted there was nothing                                                                               
prohibiting the Legislature from adopting legislation to *                                                                      
surface transportation.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Senator Sean Parnell asked the Department of Transportation                                                                     
and Public Facilities if there were any current                                                                                 
appropriations or authorizations to place bike trails                                                                           
across the refuge. Dennis Poshard referred to the                                                                               
appropriation to cover the planning process.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Senator Sean Parnell was concerned with the current                                                                             
language of the bill but was unsure if the amendment                                                                            
addressed that either.  He did not want further legislation                                                                     
to be required in order to widen the New Seward Highway.                                                                        
However, he felt the language was too broad. Until a better                                                                     
solution was offered, he would support the amendment.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
By a vote of 4-5, the amendment failed to be adopted.                                                                           
Senator Al Adams, Senator Pete Kelly, Senator Lyda Green                                                                        
and Senator Sean Parnell voted in favor.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Senator Dave Donley offered a motion to move the bill from                                                                      
committee. Senator Al Adams objected.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Senator Sean Parnell stated he would vote to report the                                                                         
bill from committee. However, he felt the bill needed to be                                                                     
amended to address the matter of widening the highway.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
The bill was reported from committee by a vote of 7-2.                                                                          
Senator Al Adams and Senator Randy Phillips cast nay votes.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNED                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Senator Torgerson recessed the meeting to the call of the                                                                       
chair at 3:25PM.                                                                                                                
SFC-99 (1) 5/16/99                                                                                                              

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